Midweek Politics with David Pakman – ACLU Attorney Bill Newman on AZ Law, God Hates Fags (2 of 2)


you actually defended you told me the
story when you first started with the a_c_l_u_ paul cameron who we had to
already represented him out enough defended is the right word and he was
also laid out the content of anything he set the right he was on the show one of the most controversial interviews
that that we’ve done when most popular interviews of course the very anti gay sex researcher now use the term
researcher very loosely ramai understands is a defrocked psychologists
other has a long story anyway claims he left the a_p_a_ before they kicked them
out but the e_p_a_ says people can’t do that once we start investigating them they can just leave the l what was that like i know you never
personally met the guy right did i talked to on the phone because i really
thought it was my obligation and know what he was going to say it was you
really going to say these actually hara find things there toward tributed to him and the answer that yes yes he was
actually going to say that he was actually believe going to express his
beliefs on us so he was coming to the university of now he was here he was
invited to u masked by the young republican club notarized students for america yeah there’s strong quest fertilization
between those two organizations is s is over twenty years of an out there and uh… they wanted to bring paul
camera on the campus drinking pride week right and there was uh… fight about that in the campus said u_s_
took the position nikki can come but only he pays for his
own security course set off all sorts of alarm bells
at the a_c_l_u_ because the last time university masters amherst right to do
that was when the speaker was angela davis so
that’s just not a good reason to keep the person off the university campus in
response the camps at the largest gay rights demonstration history western
massachusetts they were teachers their work plants in his speech there were is that nor miss campus response it was the engendered the greatest gay rights demonstration as i said in the history of western massachusetts
which led to the i think a good uh… paradigm to show
adult good speech and write your speech committee horrible speech and hate speech which is
always has the a_c_l_u_’s position when you have to i’m guessing you didn’t have
the choice as to whether to represent him or not right i mean the a_c_l_u_ if
someone calls with the free speech issue you get involved it wasn’t your choice well i think it was an important issue
to say that the university of massachusetts cannot keep someone off
its campus because of the content of the speech
because that’s been tried with all sorts of individuals whom i
think most of your listeners would say yes absolutely that person gets on but
at the university can say no angela davis can’t come on today and paul
higher and can’t come on tomorrow and this person whose controversial can
come on the next day and what kind of university two we have well this brings
up an issue that has happened that’s come up on our show many times in
happen we had racist senate candidate glenn miller on recently which is that
he he he is very racist then he said i’m a jew liar and something i said was very kite alike
so on and so forth and i don’t take it personally i mean i think that the guy
is not going to win i think he’s nuts but some people emailed me and said you
should not be getting an air time because by giving him airtime you are
somehow putting him up on a platform in allowing him to speak i think that he makes a fool of himself
and i think that giving him airtime is only going to make his case it’s going
to make an seemed even more outrageous and he was ridiculed across the internet
after the interview what’s your thought on that and when it
comes to free speech and allowing people to speak out have to get he has no right
to be on my show if i don’t wanna mon may i decide who’s on a louis does what’s your thought on that the idea of
shedding people up to make their ideas go away well but i think that is inherently
self-defeating i think they did it is long been said that sons sunshine
is the best disinfectant and when you have someone as evil and corrupt and promulgate ur hate behind your show and
you expose them i think that does more good for the world then saying
these people working under the rocks and talking to people who or hear from it to be sure there’s a risk they come
on the show and they convince someone that hatred is good in being a niece
america’s terrific and uh… hating gay people is a wonderful thing to do right
now you you think there’s some risk on the other hand i think you’re talented
enough in the show was good enough tissue when you have a hate monger on
the show you show how evil and wrong they are good for you good for the station good
for people who can make that decision say boy we got to rise up and say let’s
stop at that guys who really dead that person or really is and if that over
everything we believe it that and that’s the best performs a
public service and it’s a public good and the argument that somebody may be convinced to act based
on something they hear him say on my show they may be convinced to act in the same
way if they hear me say the opposite and don’t like me right so to say that an appearance may influence someone to
act we’re opening up a whole can of worms angry well i think you need to say anytime that anyone has a microphone someone might be convinced of something
that’s horrible that’s possible but the risk of shutting someone dancing we
won’t even with some we won’t expose this person then if you expose adolf
hitler and say look here’s what he wants to do and a lot of people said mellon at
the time so well maybe it’s not that bad maybe you will want to clear warno now
and personal had in fact if there had been mortal socialism the reviews what he said in my car you
really means that we will you gotta stop in and i think that exposing his trade
exposing homophobia exposing and all the isms that come to
infect our body politic i think exposing that and exposing them to the sunlight
and shrine in a light on sick look at what this person is saying i think that
there’s a public zero some risk their of course is it worth their risk equally clear in the last uh… less than a minute
that we have left that desert tough question which of these which of these two issues do you find to
be a bigger risk right now to in whatever to the country the citizens
united case or the arizona immigration law if you
have to pick one if you have to pick one to change which remote more concerned
about maybe wouldn’t change either well this is a pick your poison question
papers but i here the arizona log because citizens united can be is a complex
issue we have time to get into a citizens united is subject to any number of judicial and legislative fixes the
arizona law his to his lawmakers and other states
anklets copy let’s do it and if we can take this jingoistic racist law and then trying to throughout
the country and say white let’s it’s okay for law enforcement and go after
everyone who doesn’t and sound white right goodness gracious what kind of a
country where the concrete it’s a good question and we’ve been
speaking with bill newman attorney for the a_c_l_u_ of massachusetts and of
course you can also hear him every week on our show with the a c l_ u_ first-amendment many
thanks for coming in for a great pleasure thank you very much more you’ve been listening to live with
politics did bathroom him meeting all of this is one of the wind
park by jackson and connor classically modern men’s apparel in northampton
massachusetts on the second floor of ponds marketplace and by d_n_a_ at design specializing in
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